Necra-Chi

Why Does The Nisse Sniper Have A Bad Rap?

41 posts in this topic

I've watched a few battle reports where the the players discuss how the Nisse with multi-sniper rifle has been lambasted as the "worst sniper in the game" even though it was kicking butt in the battle reports mentioned. At least those players were incredulous of those claims, but I'm wondering, where the HELL did that rumour come from? 

 

You have to be delusional to think he Nisse sniper is the worst sniper in the game. I used to play two as a standard in my Pan-O in Second edition, back when it was 41 pts. Now it is SEVEN POINTS CHEAPER!. There are now two cool sculpts for it. It has MSV 2, so it solves smoky warband rushes. And it is very surviveable with mimetism and ARM 3. It's speed is no problem because it is a pretty static piece usually. 

 

It is actually stronger in it's role now that camo surprise shots aren't all that. [Edited for error about MSR shooting options] 

 

It is still vulnerable as always if the opponent brings an HMG to the sniper battle (as you should) and with the improvement of sensor troops (on models I already fielded anyway) it has taken some of the need for MSVs as an answer to camo. So I don't feel like he's essential anymore. 

 

But sniper for sniper, come on. Nisse sniper is an absolute badass that absolutely has to be dealt with early in a game or he will dominate those fire-lanes. 

4

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

It is actually stronger in it's role now that camo surprise shots aren't all that. The only thing it lost in N3 is 2x DA shots on the active turn. Shock is a not bad replacement though.

 

Eeeeeeeh, no, not unless PanO went the low tech Sniper Rifle route, MSR still shot B2 DA

1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

No bloody idea. Sounds like trolling. Nisse is amazing. And now when MSR is same cost as HMG i personally would be more likely to take MSR.

4

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

My bad. Got mixed up with Light multis. It doesn't get shock either. Will edit original post. 

 

So, the Nisse Sniper has lost NOTHING except 7 points? 

0

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

My bad. Got mixed up with Light multis. It doesn't get shock either. Will edit original post. 

 

So, the Nisse Sniper has lost NOTHING except 7 points? 

 

Yes. MSRs dropped by 6. Don't know what another discount point is from, but Nisses didn't lose a skill, stat or equipment.

1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Nisses are tremendous. I try and use the sniper variant as much as possible.

0

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I'm used to Bagh-Mari sniper in my Acontecimento, but I'm often fielding Nisse when playing vanilla.

 

Yes, it's one of the best snipers in the game. No dead weight, all-round great set of skills. Good BS. The only thing I can think about is that people are having bad luck with dice, which happens to Nisse all too often.

0

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

If I played vanilla PanO, I'd be running the Nisse Sniper.  It seems like an excellent unit, especially with the sniper rifle range band buffs in N3.

0

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

The only thing I can think of is that there is a meta out there where the nisse just gets overwhelmed with HMG shots and never does anything and people prefer a TO camo sniper instead?  :S

0

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

The only thing I can think of is that there is a meta out there where the nisse just gets overwhelmed with HMG shots and never does anything and people prefer a TO camo sniper instead?  :S

 

Certainly true.  Figuring out where your Nisse Sniper goes during deployment depends on a ton of factors... Table layout, opposing faction/Sectorial, opposing player's playstyle, scenario choice... Lots of things.  With Snipers, there's always that huge temptation to leave them visible so they can make the most of their high-quality AROs, and this often means they simply die on Turn 1 without achieving anything.

 

Against opponents like Vanilla Yu Jing/ISS/JSA, Vanilla CA/Morats, Vanilla Ariadna/CHA, Vanilla Haqq where you're likely to run into mobile template wielders, smoke grenades and warbands, deploying a Nisse Sniper on overwatch might be the single most important move of the game.  Against anyone with a halfway decent long-range gunfighter, it becomes a big gamble and a waste of a valuable model.

 

I suppose that actually makes the Nisse Sniper into something of a skill piece.  Not so much in terms of how you use him once the game starts, but more how you use him during deployment: do you risk him with Partial Cover and a good field of fire, or hunker him in Total Cover to preserve his value for later. 

0

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Depends if the enemy has a forward spitfire or any HMG. But often I'll risk it anyway because of cover and mimetism plus the return shot usually at least stopping a few shots, then the ARM plus cover often saves it, then I decide whether I wantt to try roll guts to keep him there and face the same again. 

 

If there are impetuous warband with smoke, an openly deployed Nisse can make them waste orders stopping the impetuous orders. Or die like dogs. Then he has already had an impact on the game and when the HMG comes hunting he drops prone ASAP and hopefully survives. 

 

That's assuming he is alone or almost alone in providing long range overwatch AROs. If you have two Nisse sniper or you support one with a Sierra, then it becomes a much trickier prospect for the opponent to just eliminate the Nisse sniper with an HMG.

 

The other tactic is that you hunker down the Nisse sniper until other elements of your force have eliminated enemy upper level camo, and the opposing HMGs. Then you pop him up and dominate the long game. Even until then he always presents a threat of popping up in the active turn and catching anything in the open, including that enemy HMG if it doesn't have TR.   

0

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Dont forget that the MULTI sniper rifle is one of the strongest ARO weapons in the game. With its long range and the DA ARO it can potentially kill/set unconscious every line trooper and also HIs ... taking away the safety that HIs two wounds are against a lucky ARO shot is a huge deal in my book and fully worth the swc on every trooper that fields this weapon

So yes, this trooper is great.

0

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

New units like the MSVL1 Grenzer with ML are pretty effective defensive snipers due to cover denial, but they don't have the utility of multi snipers. There are few things that can take on a Nisse equally: Nikouls, Bagh Maris and Intruders. The rest are at a BS disadvantage. The Nisse does double duty against camo units and snipers, and against camo snipers. Sniper control is a much bigger part of the game, and having a Nisse will either make opponents take risks with their snipers or make them not reveal their snipers at all. That's pretty good in my book.

Sent from my Lumia 510 using Tapatalk

1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

New units like the MSVL1 Grenzer with ML are pretty effective defensive snipers due to cover denial, but they don't have the utility of multi snipers. There are few things that can take on a Nisse equally: Nikouls, Bagh Maris and Intruders. The rest are at a BS disadvantage. The Nisse does double duty against camo units and snipers, and against camo snipers. Sniper control is a much bigger part of the game, and having a Nisse will either make opponents take risks with their snipers or make them not reveal their snipers at all. That's pretty good in my book.

Sent from my Lumia 510 using Tapatalk

 

the Grenzer is a bit of an off example, sinc it has also a MSV[EDIT:1; my bad :(] MULTI sniper option, so it can fight the Nisse equally. but of course, your argument is still valid.

0

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Grenzer is MSV1 - Intruders are the MSV2 troop of the Nomads.

1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

The only thing I can think of is that there is a meta out there where the nisse just gets overwhelmed with HMG shots and never does anything and people prefer a TO camo sniper instead?  :S

 

That's what I figured too. If someone just wants to pop a sniper to stop opponents troops no matter what they are, they usually will be better of with TO.

Nisse is specialised. It is slightly easier to kill than Hexa, but counters smoke or odd hard. Also more versatile on the active turn. Very good against some armies/targets, but overall one should be more concious of Nisse deployment than TO MSR deployment. If someone is not more concious he is liekly to underrate Nisse.

1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

 I love it! And all players in our local club think that its a beast! 

 The online time I had problems with him was vs a nomad player. He hacked my sniper very turn and blinded him. 

0

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

 I love it! And all players in our local club think that its a beast! 

 The online time I had problems with him was vs a nomad player. He hacked my sniper very turn and blinded him. 

 

You can't hack a Nisse. Do you mean he used white noise on you? If so you should have been able to shoot every time he tried to place it as the template gets lifted at the end of the player turn. 

0

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Well I am very new to this game and dont know all the rules. But he use a zero to hack, and said that since Nisse has visor lv2 that he can hack and make him blind.

0

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

^ Nisse has no hackable properties, so can only be targeted by hacking programs that have no hackable target requirements (such as Spotlight) the Nisse's MSV doesn't make it hackable either.

Yeah whoever had that opinion was smoking something deep. The Nisse MSR is incredible with its new points cost.

1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Well I am very new to this game and dont know all the rules. But he use a zero to hack, and said that since Nisse has visor lv2 that he can hack and make him blind.

 

Hey no problem, there are a lot of rules to learn and hacking is pretty complex now with lots of new options. Like Flipswitch said the Nisse is not hackable, so the only programs they would be able to use are the ones she described or White Noise which lets him put down a template which MSV can't see through. However, other units can see through it and you have to be in the hacking area to use it so, it would be hard to get it off every turn.  

 

A great tool that you can use(even offline) is Captain Spuds N3 Hacking Helper.  It lets you choose what hacking device you have and who you want to target and gives you the available programs you can use. 

0

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

 Hey! talked to my opponent, yeah he was using the white noise. Be he still was in the hacking are thought XD

0

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

A Zero can't use white noise, can he? I seem to remember it being a HD+ exclusive on-disc DLC

1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

A Zero can't use white noise, can he? I seem to remember it being a HD+ exclusive on-disc DLC

Yup. The Zero can't use it. Someone hasn't read his rules properly.

2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

well, we are all learning XD and I cant say anything to my opponent because, usually, I am the one who dosent know the rules XD

 Besides, I still one that game! Go father knight.

2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites