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zagdag

Sepsitor and Manned interactions

Question

So a question like this was asked last year but didn't cover everything, and given the new focus on pilots it seemed worth reasking. 

If a TAG gets sepsitorized and enters the sepsitorized Nulm state what happens to the pilot? 

1: is the pilot still an enemy trooper or are they sepsitorized because the TAG has  been

2: if the pilot is still an enemy can the enemy eject them? Can I eject them to kill them (say for Extreme Prejudice?

3: are these rules different for Remote Presense TAGs? 

While the idea of a pilot trapped in a sepsitorized machine powerless to stop its rampage is awesome to imagine, it does create some rules issues. Thanks for any responses 

 

 

 

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20 answers to this question

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As established earlier.

1. States are not shared between TAG and pilot.

2. Following from 1, you can't eject pilot since you can't spend orders on an enemy nor can you hack-eject it because TAG is now friendly.

3. I don't think so.

This answer is a bit weird, though.

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From a background point of view, the TAG's & Pilot's Cubes are the same Cube. So Sepsitorizing an occupied TAG should mean that the Pilot is Sepsitorized as well - but as it's a friendly trooper what Mahtamori said applies - the new 'owner' wouldn't be able to attack the Pilot anyway.

3. TAGs have either Cubes or G: Remote Presence, never both, so you can't Sepsitorize an RP TAG.

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And if i manage to sepsitorize a Pilot? Can i manouvre the TAG if i manage to remount it?

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1 hour ago, Mahtamori said:

1. States are not shared between TAG and pilot.

Like IJW said, you can't Sepsitorize a machine since they don't have cubes. It's the pilot that is affected by the Sepsitor. 

The pilot is authorized by the TAG to use it, nothing would change as far as the TAG is concerned. 

54 minutes ago, Tox said:

And if i manage to sepsitorize a Pilot? Can i manouvre the TAG if i manage to remount it?

The Pilot, even dismounted, and it's TAG are the same unit. Why wouldn't you?

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23 minutes ago, ItsUncertainWho said:

Like IJW said, you can't Sepsitorize a machine since they don't have cubes. It's the pilot that is affected by the Sepsitor. 

As far as fluff goes, this makes sense. However in terms of actual rules, the TAG itself does have a Cube, and so does the pilot. So, for example, a Guija Pilot Dismounts to perform some objective action, ending their turn dismounted from the TAG. An Avatar then proceeds to successfully Sepsitor the TAG (because it has a Cube) but not the pilot (who also has a cube on their profile). This plays out that the Combined Army player now control the pilot-less TAG and cannot spend any orders on it, and that the Yu Jing player loses the order for the TAG since the TAG itself generates the order, not the Pilot.

23 minutes ago, ItsUncertainWho said:

The pilot is authorized by the TAG to use it, nothing would change as far as the TAG is concerned. 

The Pilot, even dismounted, and it's TAG are the same unit. Why wouldn't you?

I would also imagine this is the case, where the Pilot can Mount the TAG again once it has been Sepsitorized as well.

 

EDIT: However, a Sepsitorized pilot would not be able to Mount an un-Sepsitorized TAG. Also, I'm not 100% on this part, but if the Combined Army player manages to Sepsitorize a TAG with the Pilot inside, and decides to Dismount the Pilot or suffers a successful Hacking Attack that causes the Pilot to Dismount, does the Pilot then return to the control of their original Player?

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3 minutes ago, Philamilapeed said:

However in terms of actual rules, the TAG itself does have a Cube, and so does the pilot.

Good point. I so seldom even look a the pilot profile that both having cubes never registered.

I would guess that the appropriate answer is the pilots cube is the only cube and the TAG's profile represents being manned. If a TAG isn't manned it's Locked and inert. But until someone official says so, who knows. 

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39 minutes ago, Philamilapeed said:

EDIT: However, a Sepsitorized pilot would not be able to Mount an un-Sepsitorized TAG.

The PIlot and TAG are the same unit. One doesn't exist without the other. 

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1 hour ago, IJW Wartrader said:

the new 'owner' wouldn't be able to attack the Pilot anyway.

3. TAGs have either Cubes or G: Remote Presence, never both, so you can't Sepsitorize an RP TAG.

Thanks for the heads up on the Remote Presense TAGs. 

So just to be clear on this: effectively,  he pilot is not a trooper by itself and doesn't generate an order (its the TAG that does) so the pilot is stuck in a grey area where no one can spend orders on it. 

But let me ask another follow up question: lets say A Guija pilot has dismounted. After dismounting an Anathematic catches both the pilot and TAG with a Sepsitor templateand both fail their BTS

1. Can this even happen? The term Trooper is used throughout the sepsitor rules. But the TAG has a cube which messes this whole thing up.

2. Can I mount the pilot in the TAG? If I can't Sepsitorize the TAG (see 1 above) I could see that preventing the action, but there is nothing in the pilot rules that would seem to prevent this. 

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A Pilot cannot mount a Possessed TAG, if you remember the examples where the new Pilot Rules were introduced. 

I suppose it would be impossible to do the same in a Sepsitor-Scenario...

Bullshit... Sorry!

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You might want to check that...

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Checked end edited... 

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As established earlier.

1. States are not shared between TAG and pilot.

2. Following from 1, you can't eject pilot since you can't spend orders on an enemy nor can you hack-eject it because TAG is now friendly.

3. I don't think so.

This answer is a bit weird, though.

Manned TAGs are a single Trooper with 2 separate Profiles that can be represented by 2 separate figures.

Sepsitors affect Troopers not figures.

Therefore whichever figure is Sepitorized both the TAG and the Pilot would be affected.

Unless there's been additional clarification to support your point 1 I'm not aware of?

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43 minutes ago, inane.imp said:

Manned TAGs are a single Trooper with 2 separate Profiles that can be represented by 2 separate figures.

Sepsitors affect Troopers not figures.

Therefore whichever figure is Sepitorized both the TAG and the Pilot would be affected.

Unless there's been additional clarification to support your point 1 I'm not aware of?

I'm referring to IJW's answers on TAGs and whether you count as having killed the pilot when the TAG version of the trooper enters Dead state (which also refers to the trooper in the same way). It's an answer I don't particularly agree with, but that's a different issue.

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How does possessed and pilots interact?

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In what way?

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45 minutes ago, Bobman said:

How does possessed and pilots interact?

You mean besides that you can't possess a TAG without the pilot being on the inside?

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4 hours ago, IJW Wartrader said:

In what way?

 

3 hours ago, Mahtamori said:

You mean besides that you can't possess a TAG without the pilot being on the inside?

Mainly in regards to mounting/dismounting and being ejected, but any other interactions that may come up now people like jumping out of their mechs.

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You can't Possess an empty Manned TAG.

You can't use Expel on a Possessed Manned TAG.

I'm not sure the possessing player could Dismount the Pilot because that involves spending an Order on the Pilot.

Have I missed any other interactions?

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35 minutes ago, IJW Wartrader said:

You can't Possess an empty Manned TAG.

You can't use Expel on a Possessed Manned TAG.

I'm not sure the possessing player could Dismount the Pilot because that involves spending an Order on the Pilot.

Have I missed any other interactions?

Nope. That's basically the conclusions I made but couldn't explain why at the time. Good to know.

 

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You can't Possess an empty Manned TAG.

You can't use Expel on a Possessed Manned TAG.

I'm not sure the possessing player could Dismount the Pilot because that involves spending an Order on the Pilot.

Have I missed any other interactions?

Hang on, why can't you Expel vs a Possessed Manned TAG?

Edit: nevermind, reread Expel.

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