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Sturladur

Zerat vs Shrouded in Vanilla

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I am about to start my Combined, still waiting for the post man. In the meantime im looking at the different profiles and units and I was looking at infiltrating specialists. I can not find a reason for running the Zerat instead of the Shrouded UNLESS you need a specialist with D-Charges as well as another skill and the little point discount there is. Am I missing something? So far I see that the Shrouded has 1 BS more, Camo instead of mimetism with the only drawback of costing 5 points more for the hacker and 3 points for the FO.

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I, and many others, feel the Zerat exists only for MAF.

OR, if you've already taken two Shrouded and want more infiltrators that aren't Malignos.

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The Zerat FO is definitely worth considering, as her mix of Grenades, Boarding Shotgun and Mines are particularly nasty for close quarters battle. Notably, placing her Prone up on a rooftop and throwing Speculative Fire Grenades across a large area of the mid-field on PH9. Or PH18 if you manage to put someone in Targeted state.

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Chainrifle krakot is pretty awesome for that same reason. Grenades. And he still packs a punch if you decide to close in. Additional four inches is not infiltrate for deployment, but 14 pts is not a bad thing for vanilla CA as every "position player" seems to cost an arm and a leg. I have a krakot everywhere I go.

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Yeah ok my opnion is more or less inline with @Reece. Grenades can be situationally nice but I think that in 2 years of playing I have used them 2 or 3 times always resulting horribly on my end. Guess I just never learned to use them and thats on me hehe. Krakots are awesome just need to put mine together n hes good to go :D

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Grenades are awesome because you don't need to expose yourself at all to use them.

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A little side topic here, but referencing grenade possibilities.

So, I recently dabbled in PanO and I was running a pair of Peacemakers (Mech Deploy Remotes with Aux Bots). My opponent was running Ariadna. He ran his Dog Warriors up and started lobbing grenades over a wall at my helpless bots. Being bots, they're dodging spec fire shots at -6. They're definitely a great way of handling Remotes.

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@IJW Wartrader that zerat thing is hilarious.  You're truly an evil overlord.

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For added nastiness, if it's a flat roof and there's nobody high up enough to see her while Prone, she can crawl up within an inch of the edge and lay a Mine that can see 'down' beside the building, then with the next Order throw a Speculative Grenade at someone who will trigger the Mine if they try to Dodge. :evil:

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That is it's 2 orders though, and a dodge is a dodge (albeit 9's avg vs 9's) which seems an inefficient way of dealing with a run of the mill midfield unit when you have a boarding shotgun, camp and mimetism.

sure, they fail and they are making double armour saves, same vs the BS no ?

 

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20 minutes ago, Iteken said:

That is it's 2 orders though, and a dodge is a dodge (albeit 9's avg vs 9's) which seems an inefficient way of dealing with a run of the mill midfield unit when you have a boarding shotgun, camp and mimetism.

sure, they fail and they are making double armour saves, same vs the BS no ?

 

I once went through a whole Adepticon game dropping mines and then shooting stuff with shotguns. They kept passing the shotgun saves and then going down to the mines. It was pretty comical.

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Spec fire grenades are great for (i) those annoying ODD/TO units, (ii) grouped models, (inc fire-teams), and (iii) models on suppression fire.

And even if you never get to throw them, it tends to pressure your opponent into spreading out models, and spending those extra orders to carefully not allow any AROs to catch multiple models.

 

NB: I mostly play Ariadna, with their higher PH, but their grenades have actually helped more than even I'd expected - e.g. took out a tightly grouped haris team of ODD models, without worrying about the -6 to hit and all of those B2 AROs.

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My opponents keep forgetting that Daturazi have grenades - they do lead to some comedy (cocky) moments where they are moving out of Chainrifle range and hoping smoke is thrown....   Grenades are great.

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Haha yeah il have to give them a better try and see if I cant improve with them :) Definately sounds a lot of fun when used correctly

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It seems too expensive:unsure:. Zerat can lob grenades at will but she have less than 50% of chance of success.. does it worth anyway?

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2 hours ago, Captain Leonatos said:

It seems too expensive:unsure:. Zerat can lob grenades at will but she have less than 50% of chance of success.. does it worth anyway?

I've tossed a few speculative grenades with my Zerat and in retrospect I could probably have used those orders more productively elsewhere. Maybe if I can catch multiple models under the template, but not for a single target. 

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Is the Combi+LFT profile useable / could worth it?

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 My Prior: I almost always use two shrouded.  They are boss in so many ways. 

Everyone above has mads good points about the Zerat and all are quite valid. If I can offer comentary on the Hacker, I think she is not bad. Stop! Is an awesome Hacking ARO, and D-charges on a hacker means she can do all but three of the Classifieds. She also has a combi and minmicism so she can Supression fire midfield and be an annoyance. Shrouded can do that too, and better, but she is not a bad investment. 

Last of all, the combi/flamer infiltrator is a rare combo, and I feel could be used to great effect. At least, it sure sucks when Ariadna uses them on me, and I feel someone in the sphere must be kicking ass with that profile. 

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On 4/21/2017 at 1:57 PM, mightymuffin said:

Spec fire grenades are great for (i) those annoying ODD/TO units, (ii) grouped models, (inc fire-teams), and (iii) models on suppression fire.

And even if you never get to throw them, it tends to pressure your opponent into spreading out models, and spending those extra orders to carefully not allow any AROs to catch multiple models.

 

NB: I mostly play Ariadna, with their higher PH, but their grenades have actually helped more than even I'd expected - e.g. took out a tightly grouped haris team of ODD models, without worrying about the -6 to hit and all of those B2 AROs.

This is how I feel about them too. Having at least one midfield grenade unit available in a list gives you so many more options against units that are difficult for LoF fighting.

I still think Spec Fire is one of the most underutilized things in Infinity. It's a whole other dimension/approach for your toolkit once you get good at it.

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On ‎4‎/‎20‎/‎2017 at 1:54 PM, Iteken said:

That is it's 2 orders though, and a dodge is a dodge (albeit 9's avg vs 9's) which seems an inefficient way of dealing with a run of the mill midfield unit when you have a boarding shotgun, camp and mimetism.

sure, they fail and they are making double armour saves, same vs the BS no ?

In that example vs the Peacemaker, the Peacemaker may have a Shotgun and definitely has a Flamethrower Auxbot.  Exposing yourself in order to shoot probably means taking your chances with both a shotgun blast and a direct template hit, both of which are bad situations.  If you throw grenades though, the Bot can't harm you with any of its AROs. 

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And the Peacemaker is likely to have Burst 2 in ARO if I'm playing it. 

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